The Private Equity Real Estate Podcast – Show 7

   

   

Summary
On this episode, we have Jared Feldman, the Chief Investment Officer at First National Realty Partners. Jared discusses how he approaches a commercial real estate investment and the core steps he uses to qualify one. He also discusses how the team’s criteria for investment has shifted for success during Covid-19.

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Announcer:
You’re listening to the Private Equity Real Estate Podcast, brought to you by First National Realty Partners, where investors learn from private equity experts and insiders. We share our own real world experiences so you can know exactly what it takes to be highly successful at investing in passive commercial real estate opportunities.

Nick Cucci:
Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of the Private Equity Real Estate Podcast brought to you by First National Realty Partners. This is the ultimate resource for passive real estate investors. I’m your host, Nick Cucci, And today on our show, we have the Chief Investment Officer at First National Jared Feldman Jared has been investing in the retail and real estate related space for his entire career. He’s deployed in excess of a hundred million of equity capital for two well-known multibillion dollar investment fund platforms. He’s also advised several large private and public real estate operators on perspective investments in well located corporate and retail related assets. Jared has deep relationships with executive management, investor relations and real estate teams across the country. Jared, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. How’s the week been for you so far?

Jared Feldman:
The week has been good. It’s a pleasure to join you, Nick. I appreciate the time and excited to discuss, so thank you for having me on the program.

Nick Cucci:
Absolutely. So I have to ask, you’ve been in real estate your entire career. Now, were you influenced by someone early on or did you always know you wanted to be in real estate? How did that work?

Jared Feldman:
Always looked at real estate from the retail perspective, which as we will discuss is a core competency for First National, and what I always enjoyed about real estate is you could see it, you could feel it, you could touch it, you could go drive a location, you could visit the site, get a feel for… To really understand an investment its always helpful to be able to look at it and then see how it performs relative to its surroundings. So I’ve always found that that’s what has always attracted me to real estate, that I could jump in the car, I could drive, I could see surrounding properties, get an idea of the location relative to the trade area. So it’s for me, the attraction has always been to be able to wrap your hands around it.

Nick Cucci:
Sure, and I think there’s a lot of investors that share that same thing where it’s not a stock that I can’t feel or touch. I can go in and look at my physical real property and look at this asset. And you’ve overseen a lot of great deals. We say at First National, we look at a thousand to get to one. So you’ve looked at thousands of deals just with First National alone. And I can’t even imagine how many thousands of deals over your career. So what are the first things that you look for when you’re qualifying an investment?

Jared Feldman:
So I guess if we take it the prism of real estate, so obviously, it’s the old adage location, location, location. So we want to understand first and foremost, what is the quality of the underlying real estate? Is there an alternate use for it? Do we feel good about if the existing tenant is not successful there, how difficult will it be to replace them? Will it be an expensive endeavor? So always knowing that if the location, if we have a prime piece of real estate, and by prime, it doesn’t have to be in Manhattan or in Boston or in Miami or one of the gateway markets, but it’s relative to its location and it’s the existing sub market of a major metropolitan area, what is the quality of that real estate?

Jared Feldman:
So looking for the best location in that specific area that will always sort of stand the test of time to be a location that people want to be at, want to go to, is convenient for both shoppers, and will it be a draw for tenants to be able to position themselves. So the first step is understanding the quality of the location.

Nick Cucci:
And let me ask before we go further, have you set a criteria at this point in the location where it has to be in this main thoroughfare, it can’t be in the back of a strip mall or a retail center. What’s sort of the criteria there?

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. No, and I think it’s a good point. Location is key there. Even if it’s in close proximity, your visibility, once you become removed from the main street. So ideally we talk in retail and in real estate about being located on a hard corner, meaning that you’re at the intersection of two major roadways, so you have a lot of traffic passing by during the day. People will be going back and forth between work, they’re passing your center in the morning, they’re passing your center in the evening. People throughout the day are going to be going back and forth on the weekend. It’s in the center of where people look to congregate. So it’s important to have that visibility. And once you become even a block removed or in the rear of a center, you don’t have the same amount of visibility.

Jared Feldman:
So the quality of the location is less desirable. The amount of rent that someone is willing to pay will also be less desirable. And that’s sort of from we think about it, on a relative basis, you look at a map and say, “Oh, that doesn’t seem too far off.” But in the beginning, we talked about being able to walk the asset and what’s always attracted me to real estate is being able to see, while it may look when you’re sitting at your desk and you’re looking at a map, you say, “Oh, that doesn’t look too far.” When you sit and walk the site, you very quickly see, well, the sight lines aren’t great. If I want to bring in a tenant here, how do people get there? What is the connectivity to the center? So the location is very important. And then even if it looks like it’s close from a relatively close proximity, it could be an essential world of difference.

Nick Cucci:
I’ve got you. And I have some more questions there, but I’ll table them and allow you to keep ongoing so we can keep digging through. What’s the next thing that you would look at after the location?

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. So after the location, we want to understand what exactly are we buying. So at First National, the core competency is retail. We have the ability to underwrite and look at a number of different product types, whether it’s industrial or multifamily or office, but with the size and breadth and depth of the portfolio, we have a real value add in the multi tenant grocery-anchored real estate space. I think, that’s really shown through during the COVID pandemic with how successful our centers have been. They’ve been a place that has been necessity driven. The grocers continue to remain open, the Walmarts in some of our centers are essential for the functioning of the community. So they’ve been a real beacon throughout this process. So there’s two different opportunities that we’ll look at, whether it’s a single tenant location, where we’re just looking at a piece of real estate and there is a lease in place with a grocer, a wholesale club, a BJ’s, a Costco, a home improvement, a Home Depot, Lowe’s, or there’s a multi tenant.

Jared Feldman:
And by that meaning that we have our grocery anchor component and then there are several other tenants. They could be a smaller shop where we can have our restaurants, a drug store, your coffee shop, Starbucks, or you could also have your main anchor tenant who could be a 50,000 square foot, a grocer. And then we may have what we call a junior anchor that could be anywhere from 10 to 25,000 square feet. That could be a Marshall’s, a Home Goods, a Ross Stores. And then you’ll have your smaller inline tenants. So whether you’re looking at a single tenant or you’re looking at multi tenant, the next step in that process is to understand who are the tenants of the location. For a grocery-anchored shopping center, what is the quality of that main anchor? Are they the number one or number two in the market?

Jared Feldman:
What does the store look like? When was the last time they invested in the site? We want to understand the productivity of that store for them. So we can better understand what their likelihood to remain at the site over a longer period of time. And then also in terms of the commitments they make, not only for the lease term and how long they want to remain there, but are they reinvesting in their store? Has the store been refreshed? Is it their newer prototype?

Jared Feldman:
So all of those are important for us to look at. So we could really understand how that main anchor that’s going to draw most of the traffic into our center, how they’re performing, because that’ll also filter through to who wants to be co-located with them. That traffic that, that anchor draws in will be beneficial to the smaller shop tenants who are going to pay more rent and where we’ll be able to… That traffic will be important to them. So understanding who the tenants are, and I’ll pause there, is sort of the second step in our process.

Nick Cucci:
That makes perfect sense. So we have so far, we have our location, we’ve we figured out the great location, and then step number two, we figured out our tenants and we’re understanding if it’s a single tenant or a multi tenant sort of situation and how that’s going to play out over a number of years so that we can then get the clearest picture of how to then approach the investment going forward. So those are the top two things that we’ve started with. What’s step number three for you?

Jared Feldman:
Now that’s just the understanding of who the tenants are, is just one of the pieces. Now we want to understand what is the credit of those tenants, because when we’re not just buying a center for the value of the real estate, we’re paying above that, the price is a reflection of the cashflow that we have coming in and that durability and sustainability of that cashflow is a reflection of what are the tenants going to pay. And then also not only how much money are the tenants paying, but also what is the credit that we’re buying as part of that. So we always like to talk about that not only are we real estate investors, we’re also credit analysts as well, because we’re going to understand who our tenants are and by understanding who our tenants are, we want to understand, so that grocer, is it a single operator or are they part of a larger chain, such as a Kroger, an Albertson’s, or some of the larger grocery operators that are out there across the country.

Jared Feldman:
Now these larger chains will provide guarantees to us as the landlord, that they’ll guarantee that they’ll continue to pay the lease, even if something happens to that one location. And so we want to understand what is the credit and how bankable is that guarantee. So when you have a Kroger or an Albertson’s, which are highly rated from a credit perspective, we could feel very good that we know that there’s certainty to that. And the more certainty you have, the more you’d be willing to pay for that, so that also feeds into the valuation. And then we’ll do that as well. Not only on the main anchors, but also on the smaller anchors as well. And the ways that we could do that for the smaller tenants or the junior anchors is, are they publicly traded? Is there credit out there that we can understand who the guarantor is and what their credit worthiness is?

Jared Feldman:
And then also on the smaller tenant, is this their single location and how invested is the tenant and have they provided a personal guarantee? That goes a long way to saying, “Hey, they’re really putting their life savings into this. They’re making a significant investment. They’re not walking away from this property. They’re going to come in everyday and try and make their location perform better. And, when times get tough that they’re going to continue to… They’re not just going to walk away from their lease.” And then on a smaller tenant, if it’s not, there could be multi, it could be one of many locations that, that franchise, it could be a franchise, and the franchisee has a number of different locations. Their capitalization could be a lot better as well than just a single operator.

Jared Feldman:
So that’s understanding not only who the tenants are at the location and the quality of those tenants, but understanding the credit worthiness, because that’ll feed through, into our cashflow analysis, which is something that will move forward to as we’re underwriting, but just from the bigger picture, location, quality of the tenant mix, and then, is there a vacancy there? Not every center you buy is going to be a hundred percent occupied. So you want to understand what is the attraction to bring other tenants in there and is it going to be expensive? And we’re going to have to put that into our analysis as to how much will it cost, how much money will we have to give to a prospective tenant to fix up the space? Is that vacant space ideally suited for the tenant who wants to come in and will be more expensive to take a vanilla box essentially, and put in the infrastructure for a restaurant to come in, which will make it now more specialized and more expensive.

Jared Feldman:
So understanding that, and then as we do our analysis, and I know I’m jumping around a little bit, but the rents that are in place are important for us to look at, because one of the things you want to understand is do we have below market leases in place? Meaning that if a lease, if one of the tenants has a lease where they pay $5 a square foot, but the market is $10 a square foot, we now know that when we go to renegotiate with that tenant, when their lease is up, if they want to stay there, we can essentially double the rent and there’s going to be upside in there for us.

Jared Feldman:
Alternatively, if one of our key tenants is paying $15 a square foot, and the market’s only $10 a square foot, we need to say, when we renegotiate, if we want to keep that tenant, we’re going to lose $5 in our rent. So how are we approaching our handwriting to price this property accordingly? And the way we’ll do that as we’ll look at other comparable leases that were recently executed in the market to understand where the market is today versus where it had been historically, when these leases were signed. So I’ll pause there if you have questions.

Nick Cucci:
And this is all fascinating because it seems to me once you’ve found a location that you really like, and you’ve figured out a potential merchandising mix based on whose already there and who could potentially be there, that’s when you really start getting creative with figuring out, “Okay, there’s 10 different ways that we could put this thing together, which one is going to be the most beneficial for the company and its investors?” Is that correct?

Jared Feldman:
Yeah, it’s a very valid point, and that is correct. And usually when you’re buying a center, that’s 90%, 95, a hundred percent occupied, that merchandising mix will be in place. So you’re going to sort of have to live with what’s there. And it’s understanding what is there right now, is that the right mixture point? Do the smaller shops to tenants complement the larger tenant and vice versa. So ideally it’s been properly merchandised when we buy it.

Jared Feldman:
But to your point, Nick, about if there is vacancy, that gives us the opportunity then to enhance that and say, “Well, you know what? This center would really benefit from having a fitness component to it. Whether it’s a Planet Fitness in 15,000 square feet, or it’s an Orange Theory, a more specialized fitness operator, who could take 3000 to 5,000 square feet.” What that’ll do is one of the things that we want to do is not just have the center busy at 10:00 AM in the morning when someone goes out to go grocery shopping or at six o’clock at night, when someone comes home and needs to go grocery shopping, but throughout the course of the day to drive unique traffic to the site.

Jared Feldman:
So having some vacancy might not be a bad thing, it could give us the opportunity to enhance the center. And then also that feeds back into now there may be other tenants there who have been there for a while and two years into our investment, their leases may be renewing, we’ve now proven to them that, “Hey, we’re the new owner, we’ve reinvested into the property. We bought it to new tenants, we’ve added some vitality to it.” So that, that will enhance them to say, “Hey, you know what” we want to stay.” And if they’re below market, they may be willing to pay a little bit more in rent or we just may want to keep them at the same rent to maintain that occupancy or ideally have something that would work for both, where they would stay, but we’d have some sort of natural increase in their rent so that we’re enhancing the cashflow of the asset and creating more value for our investors throughout the process.

Nick Cucci:
It really is an art form. It’s such a process. And I love talking about it. A question for you. In all of the deals that you’ve been a part of, and also that you’ve seen over your career. Was there ever something you were just impressed by the creativity that was brought to the table? Maybe there was the merchandising mix was full, but there was a pad site and they utilized a pad site to reinvigorate an entire commercial center. Anything like that, that you could share?

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. There’ve been a number of deals and I think we’re seeing the evolution, and it’s becoming a more timely where there’s different uses that are being put in. And it’s the creativity of, how do you balance when more and more can be done online? What we’re looking for is to be able to find centers that are internet and omni channel and e-commerce resistant. They’re not going to be a hundred percent isolated, but people still have that desire to be able to go out to the grocery store and pick up something at a moment’s notice, or to get their food and have an experience and to be able to socialize. So looking for tenants that will provide entertainment or fitness, something that can’t be done in your house… It can be done in your house, but you might not want to do it in your house.

Jared Feldman:
It’s going to be a new complimentary use that will draw people to a center. So I think in some of the investments that I’ve seen, that I found to be very successful, when we’re talking about more of this grocery anchored shopping center space has been the way that some of these landlords have instead of taking in a national restaurant, and there’s nothing wrong with some of these national restaurants, but where a landlord may have said, “You know what, let me find a local tenant who captures the ethnicity of the market or something new and saying special,” that becomes a source of differentiation.

Jared Feldman:
So that is just one example that I could give to you, but it’s the creativity that I’ve seen some of these other landlords and some of the larger shopping center real estate investment trusts have been very focused on curating different environments, where they’re mixing in more restaurants, where people want to come to socialize, entertainment, fitness, and that trend, even though it’s been unpaused, because we’ve all been in lockdown, it will return. And I think that’s the way sort of the future of these centers will look and it’s being able to find opportunities that are differentiators, that will be important.

Nick Cucci:
Good, thank you for that. And I’m curious, I’m a big believer that mistakes make us better. And I’m just wondering if there’s anything that you’ve seen in your career be it a group that you were with way back, where after everything was done, you said, “Oh, I wish we had approached it like this.” And there was something that you applied on the go forward.

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. And I’ll answer that in two ways. I agree a hundred percent. We look at a lot of deals at First National and over the course of my career, and I’ve never looked at any of these deals that we’ve passed on as a waste of time. I’ve always looked at them as learning experiences, opportunities to learn about new locations, new areas that we may not have invested in previously, learn about new tenants. So I’ve always thought it to be a source of information that we can then use to make ourselves better.

Jared Feldman:
But I think probably one of the greatest mistakes that I could think of is in investments that I’ve made in the past is, maybe not taking into account how rapidly technology changes and the impacts that it can have on existing tenants. And earlier on when we were sort of at the beginning of this shift to online, whether it was entertainment being delivered online, or just online shopping, that there was a number of household names and no need to no need to name them, but that aren’t in existence anymore.

Jared Feldman:
But didn’t appreciate the change that was taking place, and we’re not quick enough to move. And it kind of took this approach that we’re too big to fail, and ultimately they did fail and they failed because they didn’t make that change. And I think as an investor was maybe in the beginning, taking that for granted and saying, “Yeah, you know what? They’re not going anywhere. They’re so big,” but, change happens quickly. And that’s been the biggest lesson for me is to really look through the lens of who’s insulated, who’s truly insulated and who is at risk of change impacting their business. And are they adopting in a fashion that will allow them to be competitive and to remain relevant on a go forward basis?

Nick Cucci:
Jared, I think that is such fantastic insight. If you have a tenant that has on a 20 year contract where they have 15 years left and you’re looking at that and saying, “Well, what’s the viability of this business over the next 10 years? Is it going to be safe for me to have them in one of the largest sites in my complex over the next 10 years?” And if you’re not thinking that way you could get burnt. Sure, I could see that.

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. And listen, and no one has a crystal ball. And to be able to look out more than a few years is impossible. But listen, change is good and tenants leave and they’re replaced by other tenants because some of their offerings become stale, and there’s a newer entrance into the market who provides a different perspective, so that’s good. Having changes in your tenant mix is not a bad thing because it allows you to constantly evolve, but really understanding that if we have a large format user in one of our centers, always staying on top, your underwriting never stops just because you closed on an acquisition, you still need to monitor the health of your existing tenants.

Jared Feldman:
So being able to always stay on top of that, always follow their business plans. And if we get a little concerned, making sure that we’re in touch with our tenants to understand how their business is evolving. If they’re a public company, we could follow them on a quarterly basis and see how they’re performing and what their strategy is. And then being proactive as opposed to reactive. So if we have a tenant that maybe we’re concerned about, we’re beginning to think ahead and saying, “Hey, you know what? Their next option is in three years. Let’s begin to think about if they don’t renew that option, how would we want to take their 20,000 square feet, and maybe their 20,000 square feet should be two 10,000 square foot tenants. Whose the right tenant in the market? What’s the cost going to be for us?”

Jared Feldman:
And let’s start engaging those tenants and talking to them about maybe their receptivity to come into our center. So you never want to be caught flat footed, so you always want to be thinking and being able to be in a position where you have a plan in place.

Nick Cucci:
Absolutely. And if you’re staying ahead of the curve in that regard, you’re then able to potentially get a tenant that’s on its way up, that’s coming up before they go to a competitor site.

Jared Feldman:
Yes, that’s 100%.

Nick Cucci:
So we’re in the middle of the COVID-19 pandemic, I would not even take a guess to speculate how much longer we’ll be in this, but how have you and your team pivoted and updated criteria as needed to make sure that we can still operate successfully during this time.

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. So, it’s a great question. Institutionally, one of the decisions we quickly made at First National was as an owner of predominantly multi tenant, grocery-anchored shopping centers, we were very fortunate in the way that institutionally we had underwritten deals and the acquisitions that had been done over the course of the company’s growth. We were open and operating, well not all of our tenants were open and operating, our anchors were, they were essential, they were deemed essential. And as a result, we’ve been very successful. Our collection rates have been very high. They’ve exceeded the industry averages. And we’re well on our way to being back to where we were pre-COVID.

Jared Feldman:
But from an acquisition standpoint, one of the things that we realized was you can never, if you look at sort of the… You talk about the black swan events, this is one of them, they happen every 50, 100 years and hindsight is always 20/20. But in this case, we’ve always talked about being recession resistant or internet resistant. How do you navigate the e-commerce evolution that’s taking place? But from an acquisition standpoint, because we weren’t sure of where these multi tenant centers that were being marketed, what the performance of their smaller shop tenants were, even if they were grocery-anchored, we really decided to pivot and look at single tenant, triple net operated properties that were with a single tenant was an essential business, whether it was a grocer, whether it was a wholesale club, a BJ’s, a Costco as we mentioned before, home improvement, you’re stuck in your house. You still have to fix things. The spring still came and people needed to do work outside.

Jared Feldman:
So centers or tenants like that, we felt very comfortable about. And that’s how we focused our business. We’ve been very active in acquiring properties for just single tenant grocers. And now, as COVID begins to… Well we’re not passing through it, we have enough data over the past couple of months to see how tenants are operating, not only in our portfolio as to whose been successful, but we can now ask prospective sellers to provide us with that information so we could understand the performance of their centers. And the opportunity that has presented itself is people are scared of retail. And retail will get lumped into a basket where not all of its bad, there are some spots that are very challenged and there’s some spots that are very good.

Jared Feldman:
So the market has taken this broad brush approach that people have been shying away from retail exposure, where we could be very focused and say, “You know what, there’s no reason why this center should trade at a 7% cap rate. In normal times, she traded a six or a five and a half percent cap rate. So if we do our underwriting and we’re comfortable, we can take advantages of good opportunities and be well positioned to have made money, essentially out front when we purchased the property, knowing that the tenant is in place, the tenant is secure, they’re going to open, they’re performing better than they have last year. And that when things settle down, that we’ll have made a very good investment.

Nick Cucci:
Well, it’s great to hear you immediately were able to find the way to pivot and take care of our existing tenants, but then not only take care of our existing tenants and investments, but then also identify what the opportunity areas are going to be and quickly go after them. That’s excellent.

Jared Feldman:
Yeah. No, and I think that’s a real credit to the founders of the firm who have been very opportunistic and entrepreneurial and while a lot of people were flat-footed, the focus was, let’s see where there is opportunity and let’s not take unnecessary risks, but let’s take advantage of great opportunities that are out there. So, I think it’s important to note that.

Nick Cucci:
I’m really enjoying the conversation. And I think I could probably talk to you for the next two hours, but we’re getting close to the end of time for the show. Any final thoughts on qualifying a deal that you think a passive investor should know before we close the show?

Jared Feldman:
I think for a passive investor, it’s very important for them to understand the quality of their sponsor, who is going to be operating the asset for them. So they should be looking at prior track record, existing portfolio, the success of the opportunities that they’ve invested in, in the past, and how those are currently doing. And then also the team. One of the things that I’m very proud of that we’ve done institutionally is the quality of the infrastructure that’s been built out. There will be a lot of sponsors that will buy good assets and people have different operating models and they’ll bring in third party managers to operate those centers as opposed to everything at First National is done internally. So we have a property management and asset management, leasing acquisition, marketing, accounting, everything’s done internally.

Jared Feldman:
And I feel that that allows us to focus more on being able to enter into better deals with vendors on the property, whether it’s as basic as the landscaping, the parking lot cleanup is being done, to managing those relationships and finding out ways where we could make sure that we’re not spending money unnecessarily. And I think that all having that approach will provide more upside to a partner in a deal because we’re going to be generating more cashflow.

Jared Feldman:
So I think it’s important for any past investor to understand who they’re investing with and to look at the track record and how are they managing the property? Are they actively managing it or are they outsourcing it to a third party? Because as a passive investor, you want to know that who you’re investing with is ultimately overseeing that asset and is living, thinking, breathing about how to enhance the quality of the asset on a day by day basis and not entrusting a third party. You don’t want your money to be passed around to a number of different people. So I think it’s important to look at and understand who your sponsor is.

Nick Cucci:
I think that is incredibly sound advice. Thanks for sharing that. And we close every show with three quick questions. So I’ll ask you what was your first real job?

Jared Feldman:
So my first real job was working for an investment bank on the operations and trading side of the business. And it was, as a 21 year old, fresh out of college, it was a great experience kind of understanding and seeing how the financial markets worked and the different facets of a large investment bank.

Nick Cucci:
Yeah. Just thrown into the fire, right?

Jared Feldman:
Exactly.

Nick Cucci:
What’s your favorite food?

Jared Feldman:
Pizza.

Nick Cucci:
You and Adam Rosenswag. That’s Adam’s as well, he loves pizza.

Jared Feldman:
We share a passion for cheese steaks as well, so we’ve-

Nick Cucci:
Nice.

Jared Feldman:
Yes.

Nick Cucci:
All right. And if you could travel anywhere in the world tomorrow, where would you go?

Jared Feldman:
Wow. A pretty long list, but really enjoyed, had the opportunity a couple years ago to go to Croatia and just loved it there. And would love to have an opportunity to go back or somewhere in the Mediterranean when the world returns to normal.

Nick Cucci:
Well, hopefully when the world does, there’s a plane ticket with your name on it.

Jared Feldman:
I’m looking forward to it.

Nick Cucci:
Thank you again for making the time with us today. And I would love to have you back on again soon. I hope you can come and join us and talk about some other topics.

Jared Feldman:
Yeah, would be would be happy to, and I appreciate you hosting the show and I really enjoyed speaking with you and I look forward to continuing the conversation in the future.

Nick Cucci:
All right, without a doubt. And thanks to everyone for listening to the Private Equity Real Estate Podcast today. If you like what you’re hearing, please leave us a review, subscribe and share this show. If there’s anything you want to hear us discuss, shoot me an email, my mails in the show notes. The show is brought to you by First National Realty Partners, one of the top syndicates of private institutional quality commercial real estate in the country. If you’re interested in learning more about FNRP or would like to get access to our private offerings, please click the link in the show notes or visit fnrpusa.com. Remember the show is for educational purposes only, and should not be considered a solicitation to purchase securities or be construed as tax, legal, investment or accounting advice. Thanks again for listening everyone. We’ll see you next week.

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